Little attention has been given to the upcoming Center for Constitutional Rights(CCR) case that is due to be presented on the 14th of November, to a German Court that holds International Jurisdiction. This case concerning Rumsfeld et.al role in the torture policy/activity has been previously presented to this same courte and was not ruled upon on good faith that the USA would act responsibly and rein in the criminal activity and halt the continuance of crimes against humanity. But alas, instead of putting a stop to said criminal behavior, the 109th Congress moved in the opposite direction to decriminalize torture, handing over to the President the sole power to define what is torture in contravention of recognized and established rules and laws. Recently reported in The Nation, the CCR is teaming with the International Federation for Human Rights (FIDH), a network of 141 national human rights organizations founded in 1922. The president of the Center for Constitutional Rights, Michael Ratner, spoke of it on Democracy Now and Marjorie Cohn of Thomas Jefferson School of Law, president of the National Lawyers Guild addresses the issue in The Jurist.
It seems that while America was kept asleep by the Republican controlled 109th Congress, other legal scholars and institutions have been making their cases and acting to present them to courts. Let us hope and pray, that this is a sign to all humanity, that we really aren't living in a day and age where Justice is an overused hyperbole uttered to quell those trampled upon but instead a time where this Justice is accompanied with the light of Truth, shining for all to see and understand. Least we travel this dark and dangerous road further or ever again. May Lady Liberty shine Her Light of Truth, Justice, and the American way...once again.
Submitted by tahoebasha1 on November 10, 2006 - 4:22pm.
*From Time Magazine*
"November 10th, 2006 2:51 pm
Exclusive: Charges Sought Against Rumsfeld Over Prison Abuse
A lawsuit in Germany will seek a criminal prosecution of the outgoing Defense Secretary and other U.S. officials for their alleged role in abuses at Abu Ghraib and Gitmo
By Adam Zagorin / Time Magazine
Just days after his resignation, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is about to face more repercussions for his involvement in the troubled wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. New legal documents, to be filed next week with Germany's top prosecutor, will seek a criminal investigation and prosecution of Rumsfeld, along with Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, former CIA director George Tenet and other senior U.S. civilian and military officers, for their alleged roles in abuses committed at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison and at the U.S. detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
The plaintiffs in the case include 11 Iraqis who were prisoners at Abu Ghraib, as well as Mohammad al-Qahtani, a Saudi held at Guantanamo, whom the U.S. has identified as the so-called "20th hijacker" and a would-be participant in the 9/11 hijackings. As TIME first reported in June 2005, Qahtani underwent a "special interrogation plan," personally approved by Rumsfeld, which the U.S. says produced valuable intelligence. But to obtain it, according to the log of his interrogation and government reports, Qahtani was subjected to forced nudity, sexual humiliation, religious humiliation, prolonged stress positions, sleep deprivation and other controversial interrogation techniques. . . . "
Submitted by Leslie on November 10, 2006 - 11:58pm.
Max1,
Reportedly the Center for Constitutional Rights and the National Lawyers Guild are also interested in charging Attorney General Gonzales and others. Plus, Bush was discussing Rumsfeld's departure during the summer. So I doubt this is a reason for dumping Rumpsfeld. Doubt Bush would even take this seriously or lose any sleep over it.
Leslie
Q U E S T I O N:
What have we become when members of Government are considered criminals outside our borders? What have we become when we protect those criminals that run from the law, providing them a safe heaven from prosecution? When members of our Government who are charged with reigning in those criminals, instead turn a blind eye to the blatant crimes perpetrated upon humanity? WHY DID 650,000 PEOPLE HAVE TO DIE? So that people can go about the lie? Pad their pockets for their future retirement based on corporate greed and control of natural resources? All so that they can escape to their ranch and not face a life of trials and prison?
GEE, I didn't know that I could BE a criminal and be member of this Government.
Submitted by Truth_in_action on November 11, 2006 - 6:39am.
Knowingly allowing crimes and looking the other way or enabling them is being "complicit." Sometimes being complicit results in being punished along with the offenders of the crime itself.
Submitted by mauimom on November 15, 2006 - 3:18pm.
I have nothing to add to the righteous indignation at learning that John Conyers has agreed with Nancy Pelosi in taking impeachment off the table...except my own!
This is disgusting, and will not stand!
If democrats chose to become Repulsivcans light, they too can be removed. All I can hope for is that this is a "lay low" scheme to get through to 7 January, to keep the traitors at bay. I can think of no other reason to have gone so far , as Rep. Conyers has, and then simply "cut and run" from the truth. Don't get it at all.
NO, WE OWE IT TO THE REST OF THE WORLD, ESPECIALLY THE MIDDLE EAST, TO SHOW THAT WE HOLD OUR LEADERS ACCOUNTABLE FOR CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY (and we are not the beasts that we act like)!!!!! But apparently WE ARE???!!! What's up with that?
If they continue down this road after 8 January, they better enjoy their last 2 years in office.
Submitted by wallen on November 10, 2006 - 7:02am.
". . .we have found that there is substantial evidence the President, the Vice-President and other high ranking members of the Bush Administration misled Congress and the American people regarding the decision to go to war in Iraq; misstated and manipulated intelligence information regarding the justification for such war; countenanced torture and cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment in Iraq; and permitted inappropriate retaliation against critics of their Administration. There is at least a prima facie case that these actions that federal laws have been violated - from false statements to Congress to retaliating against Administration critics." -- John Conyers, Incoming Chairman of House Judiciary Committee.
Submitted by Ishmael on November 15, 2006 - 12:13pm.
Restoring accountability and the rule of law was precisely why I got involved in this year's election. And now I hear that Nancy Pelosi, Howard Dean and John Conyers are prepared to give the Bush Administration a pass on their attempts to subvert and undermine the Constitution of the United States?
If the actions taken by the Bush Administration over the past six years do not qualify as high crimes and misdemeanors, if the sanctioning of illegal wiretaps and torture do not even merit investigation, then our democracy is lost already.
If the Democrats don't act now to hold the Administration accountable for their actions, then they themselves ought to be impeached for aiding and abetting an ongoing criminal enterprise.
Howard Dean might be wise to pay heed to the message the American people sent when they voted in a power shift in Congress...that is...if you don't make the changes we require, including House investigations of BushCo's malfeasance, then be prepared to suffer the consequences...
Submitted by Max 1 on November 10, 2006 - 11:59pm.
Watching Washington Week on PBS, they were mentioning Impeachment...and how it's off the table. They did mention Congressman Conyers in relation to this issue.
What I find odd is that people are quick to take an issue off the table even before it has been introduced. Isn't there an order of business that has to occur in order for issues like Impeachment to ever get to the table? Oversight and Investigations? And then hearings?
I know that the Congressman isn't about to be sloppy and spill the beans and has a job to do. I do certainly do believe that the work, the foundation that the Congressman did these last four years concerning the reasons to go to war was all for not.
I have now read two different articles that equivocally state that Congressman John Conyers has lifted the issue of Impeachment from the table.
Congressman,
You've done your homework, isn't it time to turn it in? Is Madam Speaker(to be) Pelosi instructing you to NOT do your job? Is she instructing you to FAIL America? Has she been in every hearing, committee meeting and panel you've been at? Has she even read your work?
I shall retain faith that this rhetoric of non-Impeachment is all for show. That you and Madam Speaker are truly concerned with retuning to real checks and balances. Because if not, what good is a balance of power on the Executive IF those charged with creating that balance willingly give up the necessary procedures to achieve said balance? Didn't we just vote them out?
Submitted by unspun on November 10, 2006 - 10:38am.
While I understand the gracious winner speeches of the Democrats--this is a very divided nation still and we need more unity and less hatred--this is a nation of laws and to give lawbreakers a pass when they have sanctioned (and continue to push for) things like torture--is not only a dangerous precedent, it is immoral.
I know there is a need for balance and that the priority of the Democrats must be to pass laws protecting the middle class, and repeal laws like the "torture" law--yet if the Constitution was violated, in direct and willful fashion, this can't just be ignored. To do so would send a message to future leaders that the Oath of Office where one swears to uphold and defend the Constitution, is meaningless. There must be consequences for violation of that oath, or it doesn't mean a thing--and That is Dangerous to Democracy.
Submitted by Dr. Alan H. Levinson on November 10, 2006 - 11:00am.
The Party of the Inclusive.
In two motnhs, this horrendous nighmare will come to an end. However just like in real life, awakening isn't necessarily the end of it's effect. Post-nightmare effects can be equally as hard to manage, sometimes more-so than the nightmare itself. The queasiness I feel in my gut as we try to unwind the morass of un-reality and deceit is only slightly better than the 'punch-in-the-stomach sensation I get when I imagine the difficulty finding the truth.
In this world of signing statements, executive monarchy, and hand-picked justices of SCOTUS, (the branch of truth and fairness), we may never really know. This Kafka-esque world of ours, that is the United States, may have allowed itself to step just a bit too far into something that can't be named...although some consider it to be Fascist...others to be Orwellian.
Like the thousand year Reich, or the Roman Empire, the United States will be unrecognizable 100 years from now, particularly if we don't address the faults that were so tragically foisted upon its citizens over the past six years. The constitution, like the bible, must be considered in the context of time. I no longer poke out the eye of my neighbor who failed to return the weedwacker I loaned him. There need to be protections against the degrading and anti-cohesive war that has been waged against our own citizenry. I beg of you, Mr. Conyers, to please consider these thoughts as you go into the future.
When my 8 year old son asks me what to do in certain situations, I always say to him the "WE HOLD OURSELVES TO A HIGHER STANDARD". We don't have to resort to hitting back, to stealing, for that matter, to any behavior that goes against our moral senses. We always hold on to truth and fairness, whether we win or lose.
Everyone doing what they can adds up. Every action matters and adds to the combined effort. Work and school are important priorities and have to take precedence for many people.
Submitted by Citizen J on November 10, 2006 - 2:28pm.
To EVERYONE that made this possible. Now, we've got the chance to undo some of the damage done to both our Country and Constitution. We have won, but the REAL work lies ahead. We're not done, not by a long shot.
I've been seeing/reading some comments from the newly-minted majority that are concerning. Such as, "some invesigations are out of bounds", referring to investigating the case for impeachment.
I would really, REALLY like to hear a solid reaffirmation from you, JC that you intend to follow up on the investigations and legwork that you and your staff have already done into the case for impeachment ("The Unitard vs the US Constitution" comes to mind), and this isn't going to just "go away" in the new spirit of "bi-partisian" kumbiya that seems to be going around. "Oh, let's not talk about all that unpleasant stuff, we're moving forward..." I doubt I'm alone in this desire.
Pelosi has said in the past that "it's off the table", and that disturbed me greatly at the time. I was willing, however, to hope that this was a ploy, and not the real attitude. However, this still seems to be the iron-clad case- the attitude persists and may be growing. Nope, not even going to look into it. Say WHAT??
I understand wanting to "all get along" but after 6 long years of "You people can get on board, OR you can just STFU. It's OUR way, or the highway", and "no meeting rooms for YOU", ad naseum I don't really think that we owe the Rethugnicans ANYTHING whatsoever.
JC, we DIDN'T fight for specific dems. What we REALLY fought for is ACCOUNTABILITY & OVERSIGHT from those specific dems. We were told in no uncertain terms that we could DEPEND on this.
The Dems OWE the People ACCOUNTABILITY and OVERSIGHT- THAT'S why they won, that's what people are interested in. If this leads to investigations and criminal charges (as we all know they will, if conducted with unflinching honesty and integrity) then SO BE IT. To begin the healing process, this MUST OCCUR.
Just because the 'thugs "in charge" wasted 2 years and 50 million dollars chasing a bogus impeachment of Clinton DOESN'T MEAN that we can never ever impeach a president again. This seemed "impeachment immunity" due to the absolute idiocy of the previous useage is PART AND PARCEL to the sickness that infects our Country. We CANNOT AFFORD to overlook/bypass criminal behavior from the highest office of the land, in some misguided battered-wife type syndrome. "Well, he said he was sorry, let's just move on from here, no need to bring up the ugly past..." Bullsh*t to THAT.
If EVER there was a "president" and an administration that should be investigated, impeached, indicted, and convicted- Bu$hCO is it.
JC, you, better than ANYONE, KNOWS this to be absolutely true.
Fail us here, and I predict the Dems sparkling new majorities will be very short-lived.
Not to be a doom-and-gloom guy, but the REAL work is still ahead of us, and we MUST not lose our heart for this fight.
-----------------
'Necessity' is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves. ---Wm Pitt
In 1940, when the people of Great Britain stood alone against the invincible Nazi conquerors of Europe, hope itself seemed dead. Tyranny reigned supreme throughout Europe and most of Asia. The power of hate seemed unstoppable. Propaganda had poisoned the minds of half the human race and the truth was a lonely refugee, struggling to survive in a world gone mad.
Sound familiar?
In this darkest of times, words of defiance rang out across this endangered island of democracy: "Even though large tracts of Europe and many old and famous States have fallen or may fall into the grip of the Gestapo and all the odious apparatus of Nazi rule, we shall not flag or fail. We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our Island, whatever thecost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender."
Winston Churchill knew how to fight. So does Howard Dean. So do progressive bloggers. The Netroots stood alone against the invincible Republican conquerors of America. Hope itself seemed dead. Tyranny reigned supreme throughout the federal government. The power of hate seemed unstoppable. Propaganda had poisoned the minds of half the country, and the truth was a lonely refugee, struggling to survive in a country gone mad.
We knew we what we had to do. We fought through the Valley of Alito, we fought on the seas and oceans of Rovian lies, we fought with growing confidence and growing strength in the red states, we defended our Island whatever the cost, we fought on the beaches of Jeb Bush's Florida, we fought on the landing grounds of Connecticut, we fought in the fields of Montana and in the streets of Virginia, we fought in the hills of Tennessee, and like Harold Ford, Jr., we will never surrender.
Today, as we pause to reflect on what we have accomplished, the tribute Winston Churchill paid to the RAF after the Battle of Britain applies to us as well, for never in the field of electoral conflict, has so much been owed by so many to so few. The whole fury and might of the government, the Republican Party, and the corporate media was turned on us. Bush knew that he had to break us or lose his power.
We knew if we could stand up to him, all of America could be free once again, and the life of the world could move forward into broad, sunlit uplands of hope. We knew if we failed, then the whole world, including all that we have known and cared for, would sink into the abyss of a new Dark Age made more sinister by the awful power of endless deceit and warmongering. So we braced ourselves to our duties, and fought so nobly and so well, that should American democracy last for a thousand years, our distant descendents will still remember our courage, and say, "This was their finest hour."
Aross the Netroots, we are savoring our Finest Hour. But we need a Finest Decade. As Citizen J has warned, we will never be able to reestablish government of the people, by the people, and for the people if we let Beltway establishment politicians, pundits, and strategists in both parties hijack OUR election triumph, claim it for themselves, and shove us aside so they can scramble back up onto their blood-stained thrones.
Well we have news for them. We are NOT going to be lectured about "bipartisanship" by the killers of bipartisanship. We are NOT going to listen to any sermons about "endless investigations" from the Kool Aid guzzlers and their corporate media whores who dragged America through their 8-year Inquisition against President Clinton.
We've just won the first national elections of the Netroots era. It was our Battle of Britain. It was a magnificent triumph over the enemies of democracy. But it was just one battle in what is going to be a long war.
After the Battle of Britain was won in 1940, the Allies didn't shove aside the Royal Air Force pilots who had just saved democracy, and sit down with the Luftwaffe and Whermacht and SS to plan how everyone could "move forward together" in a "spirit of cooperation" to find "solutions" together. They didn't listen to Radio Berlin and agree that the invasion and occupation of Poland had just been an honest mistake based on "bad intelligence".
They knew they were dealing with ruthless enemies determined to destroy democracy. Winning the war was the only option. They didn't seek a cease fire just because Hitler fired Field Marshal von Runstedt and replaced him with Field Marshal Rommel. They didn't "reach out" with a "concession" of their own by replacing General Eisenhower with a Pentagon doorknob polisher who knew which asses needed to be kissed in Washington D. C. and for how long.
Most of all, they didn't announce there would be no Nuremberg Trials, out of concern that investigations and convictions would be "divisive", discredit the Allies, and make losing the next war a certainty because being "vindictive" would offend everyone, especially the loyal admirers of the "misunderstood" defendants, who would shout "witch hunt!" and invade Poland again in righteous indignation as soon as they could dig their dead armies out of the ground and buy some more tanks from Krupp.
The scale of crimes is much different, but the principles of justice are the same.
Reid, Pelosi et al, the enemies of democracy in this country are feverishly trying to wash six years of blood off their hands, so don't even THINK about HANDING THEM MORE SOAP.
Go ahead and play your PR games if you consider that necessary, but if you interfere with Congressman Conyers or with any other committee chairman determined to restore accountability and justice to the government of the United States, YOU will have that blood on your hands as well, and YOU will be held accountable.
The 2006 election was a warning to the Beltway political, corporate, and media establishment. They would be well-advised to heed that warning. If they don't, the 2008 election will send them all off to sleep forever in Electoral National Cemetery. The only mourner will be Barney, who will lift a hind leg in a final salute and water the grass on their graves with recycled Kool Aid.
Do not whistle past THAT graveyard, Beltway establishment.
We know whistling past graveyards is all you know how to do, but IT'S NOT WORKING.
So stop your hideous whistling, start speaking coherent English, and either help us restore accountability to our government or get the hell out of our way.
Submitted by Dr. Alan H. Levinson on November 10, 2006 - 9:26pm.
Great comment...exact exclamation...perfect sentiment! I hope I never live to see another administration like this one, republican or democrat. And if the 'call to arms' of the new congress ignores the cry of the people, then they'll be hell to pay!
Submitted by AngryDemocrat on November 11, 2006 - 8:07am.
Also......I know from reading this blog a lot beforehand as a lurker, that you people are working on the passage of H.R. 635, which is the article for investigation of Bush and his criminal organization and his actions with regards to Iraq, etc...
Now that we hold Congress, what about H.R. 635, which you people have been working on passing? I have read a lot the discussions here on this blog before I joined, and even went on a link from here supporting it, but I want to know can we pass it.
I hope so.......now that we have both Houses of Congress. But what are your thoughts on this with Democrats in power in both Houses of Congress?
Submitted by Truth_in_action on November 10, 2006 - 10:39pm.
I too have heard strong comments about taking the "I" word off the table.
That comment is for the media, I am assuming, and the supposition is that the Right will fry the left if they go in that direction. Fear that investigations will get the Dems labeled troublemakers if investigations created a Right-wing check-mate on the legislative process. One more thing... the Dems fear that if they investige, they will find their own little secrets being shoved out of the closet as retribution.
There is a massive edict to appear to be the party of inclusion at all costs.
But isn't there something psychotic-sounding in saying that there will be no investigation of a president who has willfully descimated our Constitution so he could become a solely-reigning king? I thought that was why the Constitution was created - to protect the citizens against just such an inside overthrow of government!
The people of these United States of America want accountability. They want backbone. They want this country and the terrible harms done to it turned around and its former greatness restored. This self-proclaimed King George has done so much devastating, unimmaginatable damage to this country, how can he now be rewarded with a promise of no investigation?
Just because Clinton's investigation left a bad taste in everyone's mouth, doesn't mean that the Democrats can't handle an investigation above board, honest, and filled with integrity.
Through the actions of this complacent Congress and this King and his Administration, America has lost its integrity. All the world knows this, although we do not hear their comments in this government-suppressing media-controlled country. America's integrity should be restored, and that can only happen by accountability - paced, honorable, thorough, revealing and unafraid. We need to bravely peel back the cloak of darkness and throw light into the shadows, the corners, the hidden rooms of secrecy of an Administration like no other.
I await the next few weeks and months of this newly-elected congress with a wary eye. I'm going to use my Superman vision to pierce behind the veil of "appearance" to look for the Truth.
Nothing but the Truth matters. You can couch, you can dance, you can lie to others, you can even try to kid yourself, but the Truth will always out.
Submitted by Leslie on November 11, 2006 - 12:06am.
Hurrah! I still can't get over the Democratic tsunami. Hurrah for the Constitution, for habeas, for the rule of law. Hurrah for subpoena power! I know Rep. Waxman, Senators Leahy, Levin, Kennedy, Boxer, Rep. Pelosi and you and others are all working on pulling out of Iraq and making this administration accountable. I can't wait to hear about what everyone is working on.
In fact, the Democrats have already started.... Bush wants to sneak through some more domestic spying legislation before the 110th Congress starts in January. But the new Democratic Majority [love it] is saying, That ain't gonna happen! LOL. Thank you!
Submitted by wallen on November 11, 2006 - 4:46am.
Conyers Toes Party Line: No Impeachment
Something Is Extremely 'Rotten In The State Of Denmark'
Steve Watson
Infowars.net
Friday, November 10, 2006
The latest Democrat "saviour" to flip flop 180 degrees in light of their victory is Rep. John Conyers, D-Mich. Presumed to become chairman of the House Judiciary Committee in January, Conyers today said that impeachment of President Bush "is off the table."
"In this campaign, there was an orchestrated right-wing effort to distort my position on impeachment," Conyers said in a statement released by his Judiciary Committee spokesman. "The incoming speaker (Rep. Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif.) has said that impeachment is off the table. I am in total agreement with her on this issue: Impeachment is off the table."
Conyers seems to have forgotten that last December he laid out the grounds for impeachment in a 350 page long report called "The Constitution in Crisis: The Downing Street Minutes and Deception, Manipulation, Torture, Retribution and Cover-ups in the Iraq War" and later updated to add "illegal domestic surveillance."
So what about investigations? Don't sweep these scandals under the rug, John. America deserves to know the truth. America deserves better than to be kept in the dark.
Submitted by wallen on November 11, 2006 - 4:54am.
Live Vote
Do you believe President Bush's actions justify impeachment? * 362303 responses
Yes, between the secret spying, the deceptions leading to war and more, there is plenty to justify putting him on trial.
87%
No, like any president, he has made a few missteps, but nothing approaching "high crimes and misdemeanors."
4.4%
No, the man has done absolutely nothing wrong. Impeachment would just be a political lynching.
6.6%
I don't know.
1.9% .
Submitted by AngryDemocrat on November 11, 2006 - 8:10am.
I agree......these scumbags cannot be allowed to slither away from their crimes, and need to be held accountable for thier actions, especially with regards to the Iraq War.
Submitted by tahoebasha1 on November 11, 2006 - 11:20am.
Unless this is a momentary facade, this play "nice-nice" garbage is enough to make you wanna' run to the W.C. and up-chuck. How do you play "nice-nice" with a bunch of cobras? BushCo were criminals yesterday and they are still criminals today -- their status has not changed. By taking a passive position and doing NOTHING is tantamount to saying, "Hey, all would be criminals -- get yourselves an Executive seat in the White House -- then you can commit crime as you see fit and make money at it,too, and it'll be O.K. -- you'll be exonerated from any wrong doing!"
This is real AD NAUSEUM tripe!
Individuals have to go to jail for the most minor of crimes -- the crimes of BushCo are 1,000 fold greater and we are to accept it that NOTHING WILL BE DONE?
Is there something that is not understood about "you reap what you sow?"
Submitted by Truth_in_action on November 11, 2006 - 7:07am.
I see a squeeze being imposed from the top down. What this country needs is real leadership, not people making "nice" for the next USA Today poll.
If you talk the talk, best to walk the walk.
9/11 Truth Remains The Critical Issue
Democrat leadership treacherously joins forces with
Neo-Cons to take wind out of sails, massive effort
to keep 9/11 truth at the forefront of public thinking
needs to be re-doubled
Submitted by AngryDemocrat on November 11, 2006 - 8:01am.
Conyers Blog members:
I have been reading this blog for some time as a lurker, and I know you have been working on the passage of H.R. 635 in the months before the election, which you mentioned on this blog a lot before. This is the resolution demanding investigation of Bush and his crimes, and could now pass with a Democratic majority in Congress.
Will this still go on? All of your hard work on this will fall.
WHAT ABOUT H.R. 635? CAN WE GET THAT PASSED?!?!?!?!
Submitted by Reed31463 on November 11, 2006 - 11:25am.
must go forward. If not in the meme of impeachment, then in the name of investigations of illegal conduct and accountability. (Gaskells defines the difference between investigations and impeachment). I am getting the sensing from blogs such as DailyKOS that many many more people are for "investigations" and "accountability", rather then impeachment. Impeachment has some stigma attached to it, much like the word "liberal" does.
I am sure at lunch with GWB, Nancy was shown the dossier the NSA has collected upon her. For some reason this scares her. I also believe she or her family was threatened with physical harm, even perhaps shown the plans for a domestic triggering event, which will be triggered and blamed upon democrats, should they "distract" this president from his War on Terra with needless investigations.
Now that the elections have occurred and Democrats hold the majority, they failed to heed my earlier warnings before the elections that the only way to interdict this tactic would be to expose the neocons intentions early on before the elections. Then state your true intent and purpose, gain credibility, then carry through with your plan when the people give you the political capital to do so. If they give you the political capital knowing the risks involved, there would not be this wishy-washy agenda.
But heed my warning they did not and now they are stuck.
Good luck Democrats. You made our job harder again.
BTW, Soapbox4truth general meeting is still on for today. The party is over and again it is time to roll up the sleeves. This may be my last meeting if my situation does not drastically change within six days, so if you have not been to one or are thinking about blowing this one off, you may want to think twice. Lest, of course you think I am crazy or obsessed and really try avoiding me. Don't be shy, I don't bite. Hell I can't even see your keyboard. Now feline tahoe and Alma: they bite.
Submitted by Frosted Flake on November 11, 2006 - 10:48am.
Seem to have picked up a cold. At last evenings weekly protest. There was in evidence no Bi-Partisanship. Nor did the horizontal rain dampen turnout. Though it did make it difficult to speak, to hear, and to see drivers passing giving five finger, two finger and one finger salutes. If you didn't know, you might have thought the election was next week.
And, No, we did not call it early on account of rain. And wind. And cold. And dark of night.
And niether did the flag-wavers.
Nothing is over. Our government continues to hammer away at the Law, not to break, but to destroy. Same story in Iraq, in Afghanistan, in Guantanamo and in the SECRET PRISONS, excepting that the targets being hammered vary from place to place. The reason differs not. Power. Unreasoning, unrestrained, uncontrollable.
Used to be, that was just the way it was. War was taken to be like rain, a natural phenomenon, quite frequent, which must be endured or physicaly avoided, not prevented. But we learned, we grew, we came to understand that war, when it comes, comes because it was decided upon (by an Asshole) and we fixed that. We seperated warmaking authority from warmaking power. It does not follow that everyone enjoys that. Just 99.9999999999999999% of us. There remain, the Assholes. Those who put boots on necks because and for no better reason than there are boots, and there are necks. Ask them why, and it becomes your turn, to stomp or get stomped. You are either with them or against them. There is no neutral center. The object is to divide our house because a house divided against itself cannot stand, and chaos benifits the ruthless.
And in a classicly obtuse misrendering of the circumstance, we now are hearing from Washington the choir singing hosannas (hose on us) in praise of togeatherness, of Bi-partisanship, of forgiveness, of reapproachment, of "Can't we all just get along" (Mr. King). This would be great, if it were, but it isnt, because reality differs. The reality is, our Nation has been dragged to the brink of disaster, and there teters, still. The results of the elections were, to get away from the brink. Had this been the action thereafter taken, everything would be, if not great, at least close to normal. But, instead of the republicans advancing to where the democrats were, and there proclaiming the virtues of Bi-partisanship, what has happened is, the democrats have advanced to where the republicans still are, at the brink of disaster, and have expressed the intention to teter there in a Bi-partisan manner. Presumably, untill the revolution.
This is not what I voted for. It is what I voted against.
Submitted by tahoebasha1 on November 11, 2006 - 12:28pm.
This is ALL unbelievable and totally back-breaking garbage to have to deal with. But deal with it, we will. We've been strong right down the line and we can continue to be strong and fight this whole grotesque scenario.
Media Matters collected some gems of fairness. For instance, Monica Crowley with MSNBC, in the wake of John Kerry's botched program, astutely observed "how lucky we are that he was not elected president. ... The Republicans remain the grown-ups, the responsible ones on national security."
How many dead Americans has this grown-up war resulted in?
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Submitted by Citizen J on November 11, 2006 - 11:45am.
Obviously, I was NOT alone in my desire for reaffirmation that what we fought for (and WON) will be HONORED, as was promised over and over and over again. No reaffirmation has come thus far.
I would think that you'd owe us, your most loyal "warrior" bloggers, this at the very least.
WHERE ARE YOU?!
Another question: where are references to HR 635 on this new site?
I'm beginning to get VERY concerned that we were hoodwinked. Are we just dupes, fools, "useful idiots" to be manipulated?
Anyone else got this bad feeling? From the above posts, it seems so.
I have 2 kids. Occasionally when they were small, they would skin their knee. This of course would make them cry. As a loving parent, it broke my heart to see this, and I of course would want to stop it as soon as I could, and not make it continue.
Now, as a RESPONSIBLE parent, I realize that such injuries, in order to heal correctly, MUST be cleaned properly. Sadly, this process continues the pain of my child, but, it's what HAS to occur to prevent infection. Although somewhat painful at the time, it's critical to the healing process. Without it, the wound will NEVER heal, but will fester and grow.
Have the courage to CLEAN THE WOUND, Dems. John, CLEAN THE WOUND, as you promised us you would. To do otherwise is to completely fail us, America, and her People.
----------
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for GOOD MEN to do nothing."
Submitted by Truth_in_action on November 11, 2006 - 8:58pm.
Citizen J, me thinks we are seeing politics "up close and personal."
We JC bloggers are a casualty in this political decision. We really got stuck right in the middle of this one. Unfortunately, we're not important enough to the political cause that Nancy Pelosi has called a meeting to bring us "on board." I also highly doubt we'll hear from JC on the change in direction as I think the edict is to state "It" is off the table and just be mum about it. Maybe there's a threat to not give him the Chairmanship. Who the heck knows.
I still intend to follow because I do believe that Congressman JC has the best of intentions. His hands may very well be tied in a way we have no clue about.
But I do know that, as a citizen of these still remaining (last time I checked) United States of America, I have a voice and I'm entitled to express my opinion.
Submitted by Citizen J on November 11, 2006 - 10:19pm.
T_i_a-
Did you ever see one of those Bugs Bunny (I think) cartoons where Bugs would fool Elmer, and Elmer's head would then be replaced by an "all-day sucker"?
I kinda feel like Elmer.
I guess we'll see, and hope for the right thing.
----------
"Those that can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities."
Submitted by carynamy17 on November 15, 2006 - 11:50am.
I would be happy to see the first order of business be Iraq, especially since I am an Iraq War Vet wife whose husband may be the subject of the next back door draft. But Conyers has promised us oversight, and I trust him, so far, to deliver. That may come in various forms, so I'll wait and see. With real oversight should come accountability, and the results of that could come in the form of resignations and other concessions. I'll be watching with baited breath, as I'm sure will many.
Submitted by Frosted Flake on November 15, 2006 - 12:35pm.
And welcome to the disscussion.
Politics is (said to be) the art of the possible. And it makes for strange bedfellows. Nor is there reason for surprise if there should be a mess in the middle of a fight, however parlimentarian.
But.
The frustration is...
The powers of the United States Government were delegated to it through a formal process, recorded in the Constitution. This did not create the U.S., that was done with guns. The Constitution made the United States a safe and predictable country to live in, by stating the government can't do this, that, or the other thing.
This : Arrest without warrent.
That : Imprisonment without trial.
The other thing : Torture.
Which of these is a good thing? Why do we have them? And how are we going to get rid of them, this time forever?
This is what oversight is all about. How these objectives get met is open to some flexibility. That they get met is not.
And as for pre-emptive war, it does not even merit consideration. There is no circumstance where it would be a good idea.
Submitted by Patriot on November 11, 2006 - 1:12pm.
Our General Membership meeting is now in progress. All ConyersBloggers are welcome to attend. We're doing a lot of celebrating and then talking about what the future holds for us. We're not done by any means!
To join, Click here and "Login". After login, follow path:
Members (top left) > Soapbox4Truth > Chat > Enter
This is an exciting time. Please come and share your thoughts and feelings.
More fighting words
Little attention has been given to the upcoming Center for Constitutional Rights(CCR) case that is due to be presented on the 14th of November, to a German Court that holds International Jurisdiction. This case concerning Rumsfeld et.al role in the torture policy/activity has been previously presented to this same courte and was not ruled upon on good faith that the USA would act responsibly and rein in the criminal activity and halt the continuance of crimes against humanity. But alas, instead of putting a stop to said criminal behavior, the 109th Congress moved in the opposite direction to decriminalize torture, handing over to the President the sole power to define what is torture in contravention of recognized and established rules and laws. Recently reported in The Nation, the CCR is teaming with the International Federation for Human Rights (FIDH), a network of 141 national human rights organizations founded in 1922. The president of the Center for Constitutional Rights, Michael Ratner, spoke of it on Democracy Now and Marjorie Cohn of Thomas Jefferson School of Law, president of the National Lawyers Guild addresses the issue in The Jurist.
It seems that while America was kept asleep by the Republican controlled 109th Congress, other legal scholars and institutions have been making their cases and acting to present them to courts. Let us hope and pray, that this is a sign to all humanity, that we really aren't living in a day and age where Justice is an overused hyperbole uttered to quell those trampled upon but instead a time where this Justice is accompanied with the light of Truth, shining for all to see and understand. Least we travel this dark and dangerous road further or ever again. May Lady Liberty shine Her Light of Truth, Justice, and the American way...once again.
What goes around . . . .!
*From Time Magazine*
"November 10th, 2006 2:51 pm
Exclusive: Charges Sought Against Rumsfeld Over Prison Abuse
A lawsuit in Germany will seek a criminal prosecution of the outgoing Defense Secretary and other U.S. officials for their alleged role in abuses at Abu Ghraib and Gitmo
By Adam Zagorin / Time Magazine
Just days after his resignation, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is about to face more repercussions for his involvement in the troubled wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. New legal documents, to be filed next week with Germany's top prosecutor, will seek a criminal investigation and prosecution of Rumsfeld, along with Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, former CIA director George Tenet and other senior U.S. civilian and military officers, for their alleged roles in abuses committed at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison and at the U.S. detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
The plaintiffs in the case include 11 Iraqis who were prisoners at Abu Ghraib, as well as Mohammad al-Qahtani, a Saudi held at Guantanamo, whom the U.S. has identified as the so-called "20th hijacker" and a would-be participant in the 9/11 hijackings. As TIME first reported in June 2005, Qahtani underwent a "special interrogation plan," personally approved by Rumsfeld, which the U.S. says produced valuable intelligence. But to obtain it, according to the log of his interrogation and government reports, Qahtani was subjected to forced nudity, sexual humiliation, religious humiliation, prolonged stress positions, sleep deprivation and other controversial interrogation techniques. . . . "
More
Curious timing
MAX 1, do you think this could be another reason that Bush et al decided to cut the Rummy ballast loose? Excess baggage overboard?
Timing
Max1,
Reportedly the Center for Constitutional Rights and the National Lawyers Guild are also interested in charging Attorney General Gonzales and others. Plus, Bush was discussing Rumsfeld's departure during the summer. So I doubt this is a reason for dumping Rumpsfeld. Doubt Bush would even take this seriously or lose any sleep over it.
Leslie
Don't know what is actually
Don't know what is actually going on in Bush's Brain...but soon, many of his cabinet may not be welcome outside our borders, least they be arrested.
We can only hope, Max!
Would be the best solution yet, IMHO!
Plus, if you noticed, these people in Germany are involved with war crime tribunals and the like!
"THEY" need to go -- NOW!
What have we become???
Q U E S T I O N:
What have we become when members of Government are considered criminals outside our borders? What have we become when we protect those criminals that run from the law, providing them a safe heaven from prosecution? When members of our Government who are charged with reigning in those criminals, instead turn a blind eye to the blatant crimes perpetrated upon humanity? WHY DID 650,000 PEOPLE HAVE TO DIE? So that people can go about the lie? Pad their pockets for their future retirement based on corporate greed and control of natural resources? All so that they can escape to their ranch and not face a life of trials and prison?
GEE, I didn't know that I could BE a criminal and be member of this Government.
Is it becoming a prerequisite?
Truth_in_action
Knowingly allowing crimes and looking the other way or enabling them is being "complicit." Sometimes being complicit results in being punished along with the offenders of the crime itself.
No Impeachment
I have nothing to add to the righteous indignation at learning that John Conyers has agreed with Nancy Pelosi in taking impeachment off the table...except my own!
This is disgusting, and will not stand!
If democrats chose to become Repulsivcans light, they too can be removed. All I can hope for is that this is a "lay low" scheme to get through to 7 January, to keep the traitors at bay. I can think of no other reason to have gone so far , as Rep. Conyers has, and then simply "cut and run" from the truth. Don't get it at all.
NO, WE OWE IT TO THE REST OF THE WORLD, ESPECIALLY THE MIDDLE EAST, TO SHOW THAT WE HOLD OUR LEADERS ACCOUNTABLE FOR CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY (and we are not the beasts that we act like)!!!!! But apparently WE ARE???!!! What's up with that?
If they continue down this road after 8 January, they better enjoy their last 2 years in office.
This is why many of us fought
". . .we have found that there is substantial evidence the President, the Vice-President and other high ranking members of the Bush Administration misled Congress and the American people regarding the decision to go to war in Iraq; misstated and manipulated intelligence information regarding the justification for such war; countenanced torture and cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment in Iraq; and permitted inappropriate retaliation against critics of their Administration. There is at least a prima facie case that these actions that federal laws have been violated - from false statements to Congress to retaliating against Administration critics." -- John Conyers, Incoming Chairman of House Judiciary Committee.
Restoring accountability and
Restoring accountability and the rule of law was precisely why I got involved in this year's election. And now I hear that Nancy Pelosi, Howard Dean and John Conyers are prepared to give the Bush Administration a pass on their attempts to subvert and undermine the Constitution of the United States?
If the actions taken by the Bush Administration over the past six years do not qualify as high crimes and misdemeanors, if the sanctioning of illegal wiretaps and torture do not even merit investigation, then our democracy is lost already.
If the Democrats don't act now to hold the Administration accountable for their actions, then they themselves ought to be impeached for aiding and abetting an ongoing criminal enterprise.
Are the Dems Stupid or Just Not Listening?
Dean tells Stewart: We won't be impeaching Bush
Howard Dean might be wise to pay heed to the message the American people sent when they voted in a power shift in Congress...that is...if you don't make the changes we require, including House investigations of BushCo's malfeasance, then be prepared to suffer the consequences...
Conyers says No Impeachment?
Is it true? Did Conyers say NO impeachment, just like Pelosi and Dean?
Washington Week
Watching Washington Week on PBS, they were mentioning Impeachment...and how it's off the table. They did mention Congressman Conyers in relation to this issue.
What I find odd is that people are quick to take an issue off the table even before it has been introduced. Isn't there an order of business that has to occur in order for issues like Impeachment to ever get to the table? Oversight and Investigations? And then hearings?
I know that the Congressman isn't about to be sloppy and spill the beans and has a job to do. I do certainly do believe that the work, the foundation that the Congressman did these last four years concerning the reasons to go to war was all for not.
Correction...
I have now read two different articles that equivocally state that Congressman John Conyers has lifted the issue of Impeachment from the table.
Congressman,
You've done your homework, isn't it time to turn it in? Is Madam Speaker(to be) Pelosi instructing you to NOT do your job? Is she instructing you to FAIL America? Has she been in every hearing, committee meeting and panel you've been at? Has she even read your work?
I shall retain faith that this rhetoric of non-Impeachment is all for show. That you and Madam Speaker are truly concerned with retuning to real checks and balances. Because if not, what good is a balance of power on the Executive IF those charged with creating that balance willingly give up the necessary procedures to achieve said balance? Didn't we just vote them out?
This Is What We're Talking About!
Democrats are set to subpoena
The new majority is expected to hold hearings on military spending and the Iraq war -- just for starters.
OH YEAH, GREAT VIDEO!
While I understand the gracious winner speeches of the Democrats--this is a very divided nation still and we need more unity and less hatred--this is a nation of laws and to give lawbreakers a pass when they have sanctioned (and continue to push for) things like torture--is not only a dangerous precedent, it is immoral.
I know there is a need for balance and that the priority of the Democrats must be to pass laws protecting the middle class, and repeal laws like the "torture" law--yet if the Constitution was violated, in direct and willful fashion, this can't just be ignored. To do so would send a message to future leaders that the Oath of Office where one swears to uphold and defend the Constitution, is meaningless. There must be consequences for violation of that oath, or it doesn't mean a thing--and That is Dangerous to Democracy.
Will we ever make it back?
The Party of the Inclusive.
In two motnhs, this horrendous nighmare will come to an end. However just like in real life, awakening isn't necessarily the end of it's effect. Post-nightmare effects can be equally as hard to manage, sometimes more-so than the nightmare itself. The queasiness I feel in my gut as we try to unwind the morass of un-reality and deceit is only slightly better than the 'punch-in-the-stomach sensation I get when I imagine the difficulty finding the truth.
In this world of signing statements, executive monarchy, and hand-picked justices of SCOTUS, (the branch of truth and fairness), we may never really know. This Kafka-esque world of ours, that is the United States, may have allowed itself to step just a bit too far into something that can't be named...although some consider it to be Fascist...others to be Orwellian.
Like the thousand year Reich, or the Roman Empire, the United States will be unrecognizable 100 years from now, particularly if we don't address the faults that were so tragically foisted upon its citizens over the past six years. The constitution, like the bible, must be considered in the context of time. I no longer poke out the eye of my neighbor who failed to return the weedwacker I loaned him. There need to be protections against the degrading and anti-cohesive war that has been waged against our own citizenry. I beg of you, Mr. Conyers, to please consider these thoughts as you go into the future.
When my 8 year old son asks me what to do in certain situations, I always say to him the "WE HOLD OURSELVES TO A HIGHER STANDARD". We don't have to resort to hitting back, to stealing, for that matter, to any behavior that goes against our moral senses. We always hold on to truth and fairness, whether we win or lose.
Congratulations
Dr. Alan H. Levinson
New to Conyers Blog........been lurking for months.
Oh wow! Conyers Blog! Sweet!
I already ordered the report and everything (my $60 has been donated).
A lot of good members here, many of whom I have seen are hard workers.
Well, add me to your list.......ladies and gentlement, let the work of reviving this country begin!
Welcome
Welcome AD. We need good, angry people to fight hard.
Yes, it's great to see you posting, Angry Democrat
Welcome!
Thank you, Rusty. I may not
Thank you, Rusty. I may not post that often due to school and work, I but I will do what I can.
I have been watchin this blog, nad see youand everyone here as hard working Americans.
God Bless you all!
I understand
Everyone doing what they can adds up. Every action matters and adds to the combined effort. Work and school are important priorities and have to take precedence for many people.
Congrats
To EVERYONE that made this possible. Now, we've got the chance to undo some of the damage done to both our Country and Constitution. We have won, but the REAL work lies ahead. We're not done, not by a long shot.
I've been seeing/reading some comments from the newly-minted majority that are concerning. Such as, "some invesigations are out of bounds", referring to investigating the case for impeachment.
I would really, REALLY like to hear a solid reaffirmation from you, JC that you intend to follow up on the investigations and legwork that you and your staff have already done into the case for impeachment ("The Unitard vs the US Constitution" comes to mind), and this isn't going to just "go away" in the new spirit of "bi-partisian" kumbiya that seems to be going around. "Oh, let's not talk about all that unpleasant stuff, we're moving forward..." I doubt I'm alone in this desire.
Pelosi has said in the past that "it's off the table", and that disturbed me greatly at the time. I was willing, however, to hope that this was a ploy, and not the real attitude. However, this still seems to be the iron-clad case- the attitude persists and may be growing. Nope, not even going to look into it. Say WHAT??
I understand wanting to "all get along" but after 6 long years of "You people can get on board, OR you can just STFU. It's OUR way, or the highway", and "no meeting rooms for YOU", ad naseum I don't really think that we owe the Rethugnicans ANYTHING whatsoever.
JC, we DIDN'T fight for specific dems. What we REALLY fought for is ACCOUNTABILITY & OVERSIGHT from those specific dems. We were told in no uncertain terms that we could DEPEND on this.
The Dems OWE the People ACCOUNTABILITY and OVERSIGHT- THAT'S why they won, that's what people are interested in. If this leads to investigations and criminal charges (as we all know they will, if conducted with unflinching honesty and integrity) then SO BE IT. To begin the healing process, this MUST OCCUR.
Just because the 'thugs "in charge" wasted 2 years and 50 million dollars chasing a bogus impeachment of Clinton DOESN'T MEAN that we can never ever impeach a president again. This seemed "impeachment immunity" due to the absolute idiocy of the previous useage is PART AND PARCEL to the sickness that infects our Country. We CANNOT AFFORD to overlook/bypass criminal behavior from the highest office of the land, in some misguided battered-wife type syndrome. "Well, he said he was sorry, let's just move on from here, no need to bring up the ugly past..." Bullsh*t to THAT.
If EVER there was a "president" and an administration that should be investigated, impeached, indicted, and convicted- Bu$hCO is it.
JC, you, better than ANYONE, KNOWS this to be absolutely true.
Fail us here, and I predict the Dems sparkling new majorities will be very short-lived.
Not to be a doom-and-gloom guy, but the REAL work is still ahead of us, and we MUST not lose our heart for this fight.
-----------------
'Necessity' is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves. ---Wm Pitt
A Tribute and a Warning
In 1940, when the people of Great Britain stood alone against the invincible Nazi conquerors of Europe, hope itself seemed dead. Tyranny reigned supreme throughout Europe and most of Asia. The power of hate seemed unstoppable. Propaganda had poisoned the minds of half the human race and the truth was a lonely refugee, struggling to survive in a world gone mad.
Sound familiar?
In this darkest of times, words of defiance rang out across this endangered island of democracy: "Even though large tracts of Europe and many old and famous States have fallen or may fall into the grip of the Gestapo and all the odious apparatus of Nazi rule, we shall not flag or fail. We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our Island, whatever thecost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender."
Winston Churchill knew how to fight. So does Howard Dean. So do progressive bloggers. The Netroots stood alone against the invincible Republican conquerors of America. Hope itself seemed dead. Tyranny reigned supreme throughout the federal government. The power of hate seemed unstoppable. Propaganda had poisoned the minds of half the country, and the truth was a lonely refugee, struggling to survive in a country gone mad.
We knew we what we had to do. We fought through the Valley of Alito, we fought on the seas and oceans of Rovian lies, we fought with growing confidence and growing strength in the red states, we defended our Island whatever the cost, we fought on the beaches of Jeb Bush's Florida, we fought on the landing grounds of Connecticut, we fought in the fields of Montana and in the streets of Virginia, we fought in the hills of Tennessee, and like Harold Ford, Jr., we will never surrender.
Today, as we pause to reflect on what we have accomplished, the tribute Winston Churchill paid to the RAF after the Battle of Britain applies to us as well, for never in the field of electoral conflict, has so much been owed by so many to so few. The whole fury and might of the government, the Republican Party, and the corporate media was turned on us. Bush knew that he had to break us or lose his power.
We knew if we could stand up to him, all of America could be free once again, and the life of the world could move forward into broad, sunlit uplands of hope. We knew if we failed, then the whole world, including all that we have known and cared for, would sink into the abyss of a new Dark Age made more sinister by the awful power of endless deceit and warmongering. So we braced ourselves to our duties, and fought so nobly and so well, that should American democracy last for a thousand years, our distant descendents will still remember our courage, and say, "This was their finest hour."
Aross the Netroots, we are savoring our Finest Hour. But we need a Finest Decade. As Citizen J has warned, we will never be able to reestablish government of the people, by the people, and for the people if we let Beltway establishment politicians, pundits, and strategists in both parties hijack OUR election triumph, claim it for themselves, and shove us aside so they can scramble back up onto their blood-stained thrones.
Well we have news for them. We are NOT going to be lectured about "bipartisanship" by the killers of bipartisanship. We are NOT going to listen to any sermons about "endless investigations" from the Kool Aid guzzlers and their corporate media whores who dragged America through their 8-year Inquisition against President Clinton.
We've just won the first national elections of the Netroots era. It was our Battle of Britain. It was a magnificent triumph over the enemies of democracy. But it was just one battle in what is going to be a long war.
After the Battle of Britain was won in 1940, the Allies didn't shove aside the Royal Air Force pilots who had just saved democracy, and sit down with the Luftwaffe and Whermacht and SS to plan how everyone could "move forward together" in a "spirit of cooperation" to find "solutions" together. They didn't listen to Radio Berlin and agree that the invasion and occupation of Poland had just been an honest mistake based on "bad intelligence".
They knew they were dealing with ruthless enemies determined to destroy democracy. Winning the war was the only option. They didn't seek a cease fire just because Hitler fired Field Marshal von Runstedt and replaced him with Field Marshal Rommel. They didn't "reach out" with a "concession" of their own by replacing General Eisenhower with a Pentagon doorknob polisher who knew which asses needed to be kissed in Washington D. C. and for how long.
Most of all, they didn't announce there would be no Nuremberg Trials, out of concern that investigations and convictions would be "divisive", discredit the Allies, and make losing the next war a certainty because being "vindictive" would offend everyone, especially the loyal admirers of the "misunderstood" defendants, who would shout "witch hunt!" and invade Poland again in righteous indignation as soon as they could dig their dead armies out of the ground and buy some more tanks from Krupp.
The scale of crimes is much different, but the principles of justice are the same.
Reid, Pelosi et al, the enemies of democracy in this country are feverishly trying to wash six years of blood off their hands, so don't even THINK about HANDING THEM MORE SOAP.
Go ahead and play your PR games if you consider that necessary, but if you interfere with Congressman Conyers or with any other committee chairman determined to restore accountability and justice to the government of the United States, YOU will have that blood on your hands as well, and YOU will be held accountable.
The 2006 election was a warning to the Beltway political, corporate, and media establishment. They would be well-advised to heed that warning. If they don't, the 2008 election will send them all off to sleep forever in Electoral National Cemetery. The only mourner will be Barney, who will lift a hind leg in a final salute and water the grass on their graves with recycled Kool Aid.
Do not whistle past THAT graveyard, Beltway establishment.
We know whistling past graveyards is all you know how to do, but IT'S NOT WORKING.
So stop your hideous whistling, start speaking coherent English, and either help us restore accountability to our government or get the hell out of our way.
Here-here Rusty!!
Great comment...exact exclamation...perfect sentiment! I hope I never live to see another administration like this one, republican or democrat. And if the 'call to arms' of the new congress ignores the cry of the people, then they'll be hell to pay!
Amen, Dr. Levinson. That is
Amen, Dr. Levinson. That is why you all have been working hard for on this blog. We cannot take impeachment off the table!
House Resolution 635 (H.R. 635) - what it its fate now?
Also......I know from reading this blog a lot beforehand as a lurker, that you people are working on the passage of H.R. 635, which is the article for investigation of Bush and his criminal organization and his actions with regards to Iraq, etc...
Now that we hold Congress, what about H.R. 635, which you people have been working on passing? I have read a lot the discussions here on this blog before I joined, and even went on a link from here supporting it, but I want to know can we pass it.
I hope so.......now that we have both Houses of Congress. But what are your thoughts on this with Democrats in power in both Houses of Congress?
Acting as if nothing happened
I too have heard strong comments about taking the "I" word off the table.
That comment is for the media, I am assuming, and the supposition is that the Right will fry the left if they go in that direction. Fear that investigations will get the Dems labeled troublemakers if investigations created a Right-wing check-mate on the legislative process. One more thing... the Dems fear that if they investige, they will find their own little secrets being shoved out of the closet as retribution.
There is a massive edict to appear to be the party of inclusion at all costs.
But isn't there something psychotic-sounding in saying that there will be no investigation of a president who has willfully descimated our Constitution so he could become a solely-reigning king? I thought that was why the Constitution was created - to protect the citizens against just such an inside overthrow of government!
The people of these United States of America want accountability. They want backbone. They want this country and the terrible harms done to it turned around and its former greatness restored. This self-proclaimed King George has done so much devastating, unimmaginatable damage to this country, how can he now be rewarded with a promise of no investigation?
Just because Clinton's investigation left a bad taste in everyone's mouth, doesn't mean that the Democrats can't handle an investigation above board, honest, and filled with integrity.
Through the actions of this complacent Congress and this King and his Administration, America has lost its integrity. All the world knows this, although we do not hear their comments in this government-suppressing media-controlled country. America's integrity should be restored, and that can only happen by accountability - paced, honorable, thorough, revealing and unafraid. We need to bravely peel back the cloak of darkness and throw light into the shadows, the corners, the hidden rooms of secrecy of an Administration like no other.
I await the next few weeks and months of this newly-elected congress with a wary eye. I'm going to use my Superman vision to pierce behind the veil of "appearance" to look for the Truth.
Nothing but the Truth matters. You can couch, you can dance, you can lie to others, you can even try to kid yourself, but the Truth will always out.
Congratulations Congressman Conyers!
Hurrah! I still can't get over the Democratic tsunami. Hurrah for the Constitution, for habeas, for the rule of law. Hurrah for subpoena power! I know Rep. Waxman, Senators Leahy, Levin, Kennedy, Boxer, Rep. Pelosi and you and others are all working on pulling out of Iraq and making this administration accountable. I can't wait to hear about what everyone is working on.
In fact, the Democrats have already started.... Bush wants to sneak through some more domestic spying legislation before the 110th Congress starts in January. But the new Democratic Majority [love it] is saying, That ain't gonna happen! LOL. Thank you!
Say it ain't so John.... say it ain't so...
Conyers Toes Party Line: No Impeachment
Something Is Extremely 'Rotten In The State Of Denmark'
Steve Watson
Infowars.net
Friday, November 10, 2006
The latest Democrat "saviour" to flip flop 180 degrees in light of their victory is Rep. John Conyers, D-Mich. Presumed to become chairman of the House Judiciary Committee in January, Conyers today said that impeachment of President Bush "is off the table."
"In this campaign, there was an orchestrated right-wing effort to distort my position on impeachment," Conyers said in a statement released by his Judiciary Committee spokesman. "The incoming speaker (Rep. Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif.) has said that impeachment is off the table. I am in total agreement with her on this issue: Impeachment is off the table."
Conyers seems to have forgotten that last December he laid out the grounds for impeachment in a 350 page long report called "The Constitution in Crisis: The Downing Street Minutes and Deception, Manipulation, Torture, Retribution and Cover-ups in the Iraq War" and later updated to add "illegal domestic surveillance."
click here
So what about investigations? Don't sweep these scandals under the rug, John. America deserves to know the truth. America deserves better than to be kept in the dark.
Live Vote Do you believe
Live Vote
Do you believe President Bush's actions justify impeachment? * 362303 responses
Yes, between the secret spying, the deceptions leading to war and more, there is plenty to justify putting him on trial.
87%
No, like any president, he has made a few missteps, but nothing approaching "high crimes and misdemeanors."
4.4%
No, the man has done absolutely nothing wrong. Impeachment would just be a political lynching.
6.6%
I don't know.
1.9% .
click here
My God! If that was
My God! If that was scientific, then we would HAVE to impeach!
I agree......these scumbags
I agree......these scumbags cannot be allowed to slither away from their crimes, and need to be held accountable for thier actions, especially with regards to the Iraq War.
INVESTIGATE AND IMPEACH NOW!!!!!
Something is definitely rotten in Denmark!
Unless this is a momentary facade, this play "nice-nice" garbage is enough to make you wanna' run to the W.C. and up-chuck. How do you play "nice-nice" with a bunch of cobras? BushCo were criminals yesterday and they are still criminals today -- their status has not changed. By taking a passive position and doing NOTHING is tantamount to saying, "Hey, all would be criminals -- get yourselves an Executive seat in the White House -- then you can commit crime as you see fit and make money at it,too, and it'll be O.K. -- you'll be exonerated from any wrong doing!"
This is real AD NAUSEUM tripe!
Individuals have to go to jail for the most minor of crimes -- the crimes of BushCo are 1,000 fold greater and we are to accept it that NOTHING WILL BE DONE?
Is there something that is not understood about "you reap what you sow?"
Ten Reasons to Impeach George Bush and Dick Cheney
The reasons are well stated and those that we know. Here is a petition from Democrats.com
I hope EVERYONE will act on it.
Impeach
You can't have it both ways
I see a squeeze being imposed from the top down. What this country needs is real leadership, not people making "nice" for the next USA Today poll.
If you talk the talk, best to walk the walk.
9/11 Truth Remains The Critical Issue
Democrat leadership treacherously joins forces with
Neo-Cons to take wind out of sails, massive effort
to keep 9/11 truth at the forefront of public thinking
needs to be re-doubled
What about H.R. 635, which you folks worked hard on???
Conyers Blog members:
I have been reading this blog for some time as a lurker, and I know you have been working on the passage of H.R. 635 in the months before the election, which you mentioned on this blog a lot before. This is the resolution demanding investigation of Bush and his crimes, and could now pass with a Democratic majority in Congress.
Will this still go on? All of your hard work on this will fall.
WHAT ABOUT H.R. 635? CAN WE GET THAT PASSED?!?!?!?!
HR 635 investigations
must go forward. If not in the meme of impeachment, then in the name of investigations of illegal conduct and accountability. (Gaskells defines the difference between investigations and impeachment). I am getting the sensing from blogs such as DailyKOS that many many more people are for "investigations" and "accountability", rather then impeachment. Impeachment has some stigma attached to it, much like the word "liberal" does.
I am sure at lunch with GWB, Nancy was shown the dossier the NSA has collected upon her. For some reason this scares her. I also believe she or her family was threatened with physical harm, even perhaps shown the plans for a domestic triggering event, which will be triggered and blamed upon democrats, should they "distract" this president from his War on Terra with needless investigations.
Now that the elections have occurred and Democrats hold the majority, they failed to heed my earlier warnings before the elections that the only way to interdict this tactic would be to expose the neocons intentions early on before the elections. Then state your true intent and purpose, gain credibility, then carry through with your plan when the people give you the political capital to do so. If they give you the political capital knowing the risks involved, there would not be this wishy-washy agenda.
But heed my warning they did not and now they are stuck.
Good luck Democrats. You made our job harder again.
BTW, Soapbox4truth general meeting is still on for today. The party is over and again it is time to roll up the sleeves. This may be my last meeting if my situation does not drastically change within six days, so if you have not been to one or are thinking about blowing this one off, you may want to think twice. Lest, of course you think I am crazy or obsessed and really try avoiding me. Don't be shy, I don't bite. Hell I can't even see your keyboard. Now feline tahoe and Alma: they bite.
[Ouch, I told you I was--ouch!......]
See you all there in forty minutes. Regards.
Niether rain, nor sleet, nor dark of night...
Seem to have picked up a cold. At last evenings weekly protest. There was in evidence no Bi-Partisanship. Nor did the horizontal rain dampen turnout. Though it did make it difficult to speak, to hear, and to see drivers passing giving five finger, two finger and one finger salutes. If you didn't know, you might have thought the election was next week.
And, No, we did not call it early on account of rain. And wind. And cold. And dark of night.
And niether did the flag-wavers.
Nothing is over. Our government continues to hammer away at the Law, not to break, but to destroy. Same story in Iraq, in Afghanistan, in Guantanamo and in the SECRET PRISONS, excepting that the targets being hammered vary from place to place. The reason differs not. Power. Unreasoning, unrestrained, uncontrollable.
Used to be, that was just the way it was. War was taken to be like rain, a natural phenomenon, quite frequent, which must be endured or physicaly avoided, not prevented. But we learned, we grew, we came to understand that war, when it comes, comes because it was decided upon (by an Asshole) and we fixed that. We seperated warmaking authority from warmaking power. It does not follow that everyone enjoys that. Just 99.9999999999999999% of us. There remain, the Assholes. Those who put boots on necks because and for no better reason than there are boots, and there are necks. Ask them why, and it becomes your turn, to stomp or get stomped. You are either with them or against them. There is no neutral center. The object is to divide our house because a house divided against itself cannot stand, and chaos benifits the ruthless.
And in a classicly obtuse misrendering of the circumstance, we now are hearing from Washington the choir singing hosannas (hose on us) in praise of togeatherness, of Bi-partisanship, of forgiveness, of reapproachment, of "Can't we all just get along" (Mr. King). This would be great, if it were, but it isnt, because reality differs. The reality is, our Nation has been dragged to the brink of disaster, and there teters, still. The results of the elections were, to get away from the brink. Had this been the action thereafter taken, everything would be, if not great, at least close to normal. But, instead of the republicans advancing to where the democrats were, and there proclaiming the virtues of Bi-partisanship, what has happened is, the democrats have advanced to where the republicans still are, at the brink of disaster, and have expressed the intention to teter there in a Bi-partisan manner. Presumably, untill the revolution.
This is not what I voted for. It is what I voted against.
How 'bout you?
Frosted Flake
I am at the point of regurgitation!
This is ALL unbelievable and totally back-breaking garbage to have to deal with. But deal with it, we will. We've been strong right down the line and we can continue to be strong and fight this whole grotesque scenario.
Molly Ivins, yesterday.
The sheer pleasure of getting lessons in etiquette from Karl Rove and the right-wing media passeth all understanding. Ever since 1994, the Republican Party has gone after Democrats with the frenzy of a foaming mad dog. There was the impeachment of Bill Clinton, not to mention the trashing of both Clinton and his wife - accused of everything from selling drugs to murder - all orchestrated by that paragon of manners, Tom DeLay.
Media Matters collected some gems of fairness. For instance, Monica Crowley with MSNBC, in the wake of John Kerry's botched program, astutely observed "how lucky we are that he was not elected president. ... The Republicans remain the grown-ups, the responsible ones on national security."
How many dead Americans has this grown-up war resulted in?
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
Dead Americans.
Go on. Say it.
Frosted Flake
So, JC, where you at?
Obviously, I was NOT alone in my desire for reaffirmation that what we fought for (and WON) will be HONORED, as was promised over and over and over again. No reaffirmation has come thus far.
I would think that you'd owe us, your most loyal "warrior" bloggers, this at the very least.
WHERE ARE YOU?!
Another question: where are references to HR 635 on this new site?
I'm beginning to get VERY concerned that we were hoodwinked. Are we just dupes, fools, "useful idiots" to be manipulated?
Anyone else got this bad feeling? From the above posts, it seems so.
I have 2 kids. Occasionally when they were small, they would skin their knee. This of course would make them cry. As a loving parent, it broke my heart to see this, and I of course would want to stop it as soon as I could, and not make it continue.
Now, as a RESPONSIBLE parent, I realize that such injuries, in order to heal correctly, MUST be cleaned properly. Sadly, this process continues the pain of my child, but, it's what HAS to occur to prevent infection. Although somewhat painful at the time, it's critical to the healing process. Without it, the wound will NEVER heal, but will fester and grow.
Have the courage to CLEAN THE WOUND, Dems. John, CLEAN THE WOUND, as you promised us you would. To do otherwise is to completely fail us, America, and her People.
----------
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for GOOD MEN to do nothing."
Thinking... thinking...
Citizen J, me thinks we are seeing politics "up close and personal."
We JC bloggers are a casualty in this political decision. We really got stuck right in the middle of this one. Unfortunately, we're not important enough to the political cause that Nancy Pelosi has called a meeting to bring us "on board." I also highly doubt we'll hear from JC on the change in direction as I think the edict is to state "It" is off the table and just be mum about it. Maybe there's a threat to not give him the Chairmanship. Who the heck knows.
I still intend to follow because I do believe that Congressman JC has the best of intentions. His hands may very well be tied in a way we have no clue about.
But I do know that, as a citizen of these still remaining (last time I checked) United States of America, I have a voice and I'm entitled to express my opinion.
And I say, the whole thing sucks.
*sigh*
T_i_a-
Did you ever see one of those Bugs Bunny (I think) cartoons where Bugs would fool Elmer, and Elmer's head would then be replaced by an "all-day sucker"?
I kinda feel like Elmer.
I guess we'll see, and hope for the right thing.
----------
"Those that can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities."
hear hear
I would be happy to see the first order of business be Iraq, especially since I am an Iraq War Vet wife whose husband may be the subject of the next back door draft. But Conyers has promised us oversight, and I trust him, so far, to deliver. That may come in various forms, so I'll wait and see. With real oversight should come accountability, and the results of that could come in the form of resignations and other concessions. I'll be watching with baited breath, as I'm sure will many.
Right, various forms...
And welcome to the disscussion.
Politics is (said to be) the art of the possible. And it makes for strange bedfellows. Nor is there reason for surprise if there should be a mess in the middle of a fight, however parlimentarian.
But.
The frustration is...
The powers of the United States Government were delegated to it through a formal process, recorded in the Constitution. This did not create the U.S., that was done with guns. The Constitution made the United States a safe and predictable country to live in, by stating the government can't do this, that, or the other thing.
This : Arrest without warrent.
That : Imprisonment without trial.
The other thing : Torture.
Which of these is a good thing? Why do we have them? And how are we going to get rid of them, this time forever?
This is what oversight is all about. How these objectives get met is open to some flexibility. That they get met is not.
And as for pre-emptive war, it does not even merit consideration. There is no circumstance where it would be a good idea.
TeamConyersBlog Update
Our General Membership meeting is now in progress. All ConyersBloggers are welcome to attend. We're doing a lot of celebrating and then talking about what the future holds for us. We're not done by any means!
To join, Click here and "Login". After login, follow path:
Members (top left) > Soapbox4Truth > Chat > Enter
This is an exciting time. Please come and share your thoughts and feelings.
RE: General Meeting
What a great meeting!
Max1 was in attendance for the first time and we appreciated his contributions to the discussion.
Max1, I hope you found worth your time, because we certainly found your contributions helpful.
I will post a summary of the discussion on the SB4T forum board a little later.
Missed Max 1
Max 1, I'm so sorry I missed you at the meeting. Bummer. It's a drag to work on Saturdays.